*Concerns of Young Mathematicians* Volume 2, Issue 30 Sept. 28, 1994 An electronically distributed digest for discussions of the issues of concern to mathematicians at the beginning of their careers. PLEASE FORWARD TO ANY POTENTIALLY INTERESTED INDIVIDUALS Please, direct submissions and questions to Robert Dobrow dobrow@cam.nist.gov , editor for the month of September. Next issue: Wednesday, Oct. 5. Editor for August: Kevin Madigan madigan@math.nwu.edu Editor for September: Bob Dobrow dobrow@cam.nist.gov Editor for October: Frank Arlinghaus frank@math.ysu.edu To subscribe: Send mail to Charles Yeomans at cyeomans@s.ms.uky.edu Back issues and other information are available via anonymous FTP to ftp.ms.uky.edu, in pub3/mailing.lists/ymn-list. Table of Contents Item # Title ------ ----- 1 Editor's notes 2 Letters to the Editor 3 Resources for Job Seekers 4 More Advice on Graduate Programs 5 Employment Survey 6 Matching Systems 7 Closing Credits _______________________________________________________________ Item #1 EDITOR'S NOTES Last week's editorial on important Internet resources for job seekers may have left the impression of being an exhaustive summary of all available sources for job listings. There are, of course, other excellent electronic and non-electronic resources that those seeking employment should be aware of and several *Concerns* readers have written in to point these out. We are reprinting these items in this week's issue. If you know of other sources of job listings, please write in. This week's issue also contains an update by Curt Bennett on his Employment Survey, feedback on "Advice on Graduate Programs," and an interesting exchange that recently appeared on the Internet newsgroup sci.math on matching systems for postdocs in mathematics. It's been fun editing this month's *Concerns*. Next week's honors will be performed by Frank Arlinghaus. Good luck to everyone looking for work and see you in San Francisco! _______________________________________________________________ Item #2 LETTERS TO THE EDITOR Dear YMN Readers: I saw the note in the recent issue of YMN about combining the November and December issues of the Notices, and I thought a little more explanation should be given. Part of the reason for combining the two issues is that the scheduling for the "enhanced" Notices dictated that the December 1994 and the January 1995 issues would have been mailed out within a week of each other. This is because the program for the January meeting will appear in the January issue, instead of the December issue, as has traditionally been the case. Concerns about how this affects job ads are understandable. I checked with the staff person here who handles these ads. She says that employers often advertise in both the November and December issues. For each employer who wanted to advertise in both, she explained the situation and offered that they could advertise in the November/December issue and in the January issue. Some employers opted to advertise only in November/December, while others opted to advertise in both November/December and January. She tells me that there have been no instances of employers deciding not to advertise in the Notices because of the combining of the two issues. So, it appears that at present we have not lost any job ads as a result of combining November and December. The January 1995 issue will be mailed in mid-December, which, as I said before, is only a week after the December issue would have been mailed. Therefore, the January issue will most likely meet the needs of those who would have advertised only in the December issue. Of course, as the item in the YMN Newsletter said, it is important to use all the various sources of job ads (EIMS, e-Math, etc.). --- Allyn Jackson Managing Editor, Notices of the AMS ********************************************************************* I received the following correction to the post I made where I quoted William Jaco extensively. We all make mistakes. FYI: Robert Fossum is, among other things, the chair of the Editorial Committee of the Notices of the AMS. --- Mark W Winstead PS: Don't forget to vote! Please encourage others to vote also. And tell your friends about YMN! -------------------- Forwarded message -------------------------- Date: Wed, 14 Sep 94 17:38:05 -0500 From: Robert M. Fossum robert@odin.math.uiuc.edu To: mwwinst@gcr.com Subject: Bylaws Dear Mark, The Bylaws are published in the November issue of the Notices every ODD year. They appear on page 1266 of the November 1993 issue. They will appear again in Nov 1995. I don't know yet, which page. Robert ------------------- End of forwarded message --------------------- _______________________________________________________________ Item #3 RESOURCES FOR JOB SEEKERS In your latest issue you note the AMS job search facility and the Chronicle of Higher Education, which are obviously important sources for job ads. You fail to mention Focus, the newsletter of the MAA, which is also an important source. Advertising in the Chronicle is rather expensive so you may find some schools choosing to advertise elsewhere. Another source which should be looked at is the Association for Women in Mathematics (AWM) newsletter. If your school is not a member, it should be. Institutional members are allowed two free advertisements per year, so you are likely to find more schools using this journal. --- Bryan Hearsey, Chairman Department of Mathematical Sciences Lebanon Valley College (PA) *********************************************************************** One valuable resource that I have discovered recently is also available via Internet, and typically is mutually exclusive of all other sources that were cited last week. If you are considering applying for a job with the federal government, you will find FEDWORLD extremely valuable. All federal government jobs are advertised in a brief form, and directions are given for finding more. I won't go into details on how to get to the job postings, because they are easy to find, just follow your nose. As a matter of fact, it is clear that the most popular use of FEDWORLD is the job postings, so the system adminstrators have placed the job listings on the main menu. FEDWORLD also contains an information service on scholarships, grants, fellowships and research equipment. From what I can tell, having not explored this yet, this is not complete information, as one description of FEDWORLD that I have says that several sources, including the NSF, only lists minority information here. Three ways to connect: 1) Telnet address is fedworld.gov 2) World Wide Web is www.fedworld.gov 3) By personal computer and modem, dial 703-321-8020, with settings 8-N-1. Terminal emulation should be ANSI. It would appear that FEDWORLD supports all common modem speeds, including the one I use, 14400. The first time you login, you will be required to set up an account. There is a time limit of two hours a session and three hours a day. FEDWORLD is up 23 and a half hours a day, according to the intro material. One last thing: if you are applying to the federal government, be sure to download the zip file that contains files to allow you to use windows to electronically prepare the SF171. I forget the name, but you will know it by the descriptions given in the job subdirectory. The same directory contains the files required to unzip, if you don't already have them. --- Mark Winstead mwwinst@gcr.com P.S. I would like to thank all who have taken the time to vote for me in the AMS election. Please take the time to encourage others to vote, even if they won't vote for me. _______________________________________________________________ Item #4 MORE ADVICE ON GRADUATE PROGRAMS Volume 2, Issue 29 of the "Concerns of Young Mathematicians" included an article by me giving "Advice on Graduate Programs." Gerald Janusz, the chair of the math department at U.Illinois Urbana-Champaign, wrote me to point out that my comments on U.Illinois were confusing and misleading. I said: Here's a typical response where I have doubts about the program despite the respondent's reassurances: By the way, my Master's work was at the Univ. of Illinois in Urbana-Champaign, which was certainly a friendly place to be with lots of teachng assistantships. But, I recall feeling a little "lost" in such a large department. If I was to return to Illinois I think I would be a little more forward in coming to know professors (and I suspect that the strategy might work). Overall a positive impression and some very good people too! ' " Professor Janusz pointed out that: You seem to be quoting a favorable response from a former student yet you dismiss it by your opening statement. Would you be willing to share your reasons for having "doubts about the program" ? What I meant, but did not state clearly, was this: certainly the comments that U.Illinois is "a friendly place" with "lots of teaching assistantships" are positive. The respondent who I quoted did not seem to feel that the size of the department, which made them feel "a little lost," was a negative feature. For myself, I don't like large departments, so to me, the size of the department is a minus. This personal reservation about the size of the program is just that, a personal reservation, and does not reflect on the quality of the program per se. The former student did report an overall positive impression. What I meant to point out was that since reasonable people can disagree about the desirable and necessary features of a department they will do well in, readers should compare others' impressions of departments to their own criteria. Professor Janusz sent me a fuller description of the ways in which his department meets the needs of graduate students, which I include here. In my 2.5 years as chairman of this department, I have had many conversations with graduate students and made a serious effort to address their needs and concerns. I believe we have a very good group of graduate students and their morale does not seem low, as your quote might lead one to believe. A person who can only thrive in a small program should probably not consider the University of Illinois. (FYI the graduate enrollment in the mathematics department is about 250 plus or minus) However we have a program that has many elements of smaller programs: - most of our graduate courses have enrollments of less than 10 (exceptions are the basic courses that cover material for the comprehensive exams where enrollment may go higher)--many second year graduate courses have enrollments of 5 to 8; - our departmental lounge is not a faculty lounge but is a faculty-graduate student lounge where coffee and cookies are served every day (graduate students and faculty regularly attend and have opportunity for informal interaction); - we have a very active seminar schedule (a dozen or more research and study seminars each week) to which graduate students are welcome to attend and participate. Two of the seminares are student seminars which faculty attend. - We have a full time graduate advisor who is available for consultation; a significant part of his time is spent talking with graduate students. - We have a departmental picnic at the beginning of the Fall semester to give the graduate students and their families a chance to meet faculty and their families; - new students are welcomed during an orientation week, a part of which is a cookout with faculty; - we have a holiday party for faculty and graduate students every year. I don't mean to bore you with too many details but the point is we do try to make graduate students feel welcome here. Of course, all these activities require some effort on the part of the graduate students; there are some who do not show up at any of these activities and, for them, there may be a feeling of being left out. We encourage students to take part but some do not. It may be that you have met one of the students who did not share any of these activities and thus formed an inaccurate impression of the University of Illinois. Had I had this description when I put together last week's article on "Advice on Graduate Programs" for YMN, I would not have expressed any reservations at all about the U.Illinois at Urbana-Champaign in that article. In general, all the comments on schools in that article reflected the viewpoint of only one respondent. People should investigate schools on their own, to get a variety of points of view. Even my comment on Princeton ("very non-supportive") should be read partly in light of the kind of program I was looking for advice on: a program that had a structured set of first-year courses and exams, among other things. Princeton (last I knew) has no set graduate curriculum at all; this may be exactly the environment some people are ready for for their graduate study; for others, more structure and guidance is crucial. Sharon Pedersen pedersen@polar.bowdoin.edu (Brunswick, Maine) _______________________________________________________________ Item #5 EMPLOYMENT SURVEY It has been pointed out to me that there have been changes over the last several years in the job market that have probably made my study taken between May 1 and June 14 less accurate. Namely that: 1) The job market has extended a long time in the last several years; 2) Many of the candidates that were unemployed in mid-May had job offers by the end of July; and 3) People should be aware that with the way many state universities are financed, there will almost certainly be positions available in June of several year duration and many one year positons in July. While I am quite certain that 2) and 3) are correct, I would like to get a better feeling for how many offers come out that late. As a result, I would like to update the survey I did last May/June. If you responded to the last survey because you had a job offer, there is no need to respond to this survey. On the other hand, if you responded and didn't have a job offer but have since received an offer, I would appreciate it if you could send me an update. Also, if you didn't respond to the last survey, I would also like to know how you fared last year. In particular, if you would let me know 1) What type of job you received: 1-year, 2-year, 3-year, tenure track, part time 2) When you received your offer: If you were on the market got nothing and delayed graduation, I would also like to know. Thank you very much, Curtis Bennett cbennet@math.bgsu.edu _______________________________________________________________ Item #6 MATCHING SYSTEMS The following appeared on sci.math. I thought it might be of interest to readers of CYM, especially the younger ones. I found it informative. Mark W. Winstead mwwinst@gcr.com ************************************************************* In article 35ijhn$sac@ukelele.gcr.com , Mark W Winstead mwwinst@ukelele.gcr.com wrote: A lot of sensible things. In addition, What is your opinion of the following: i) AMS-administered matching system for postdocs, patterned after the resident-matching system used by the medical profession. There are big differences between mathematics and medicine, and between the AMS and the AMA. For instance, consider when specialities are decided. Also, the AMA is actively involved in licensing doctors, medical schools and health care providers, while the AMS does nothing analogous. This means that the AMA has a BIG stick that the AMS doesn't. However, of the 1993 graduates, more than a third of them employed at Ph.D producing departments where at the department awarding their degrees. [note: 81 of 223] I think we could explore the feasibility of a matching program by starting with departments which are employing their own graduates in this way. Each year the program is successful, it could be expanded the next. I am continually amazed at the ignorance about the intern/resident matching program exhibited by mathematicians. This is basically a mathematical question with a mathematical solution. Let me make two remarks. The matching program is voluntary. Neither hospitals nor prospective residents need abide by it. The reason they do is because, _by_design_, they can't do better by going outside it. The power of the AMA has nothing to do with it. Secondly, the matching program was adopted (I think in the late 50s or thereabouts) because the employers, the hospitals, because of a surplus of jobs over candidates, were being forced to make offers earlier and earlier. It got to the point where some offers were made in the year prior to the year of graduation. As a result, they tried to by agreement make all offers at the same time. This system also quickly exhibited structural problems, so they went all the way and decided on the current system. Fortunately, they picked an algorithm which produces stable matchings. There does not exist a pair which by dropping their current matches and choosing each other can both do better. The main reform associated with such a system which would have a beneficial effect on the job market would be an arrangement where all parties, departments and candiates, have full knowledge of all their options before having to make a choice. The reason why we stick with the current situation is that the employers, i.e., mathematics departments and their institutions, think they can do better than a stable matching. They think they can hire people who, if they had full knowledge of all their choices, would go elsewhere. Now clearly this is not possible for all departments. This seems to me to be an example of the classic prisoner's dilemma paradox. The only solution is cooperative action. All we have to be willing to give up is tactical advantage which most likely won't do us any good in any case. We can still compete effectively in everything else for the best faculty we can get. I also believe that this desire to do better than we merit because of what we can offer is a factor in the prevalence of temporary hirees. It leads departments to postpone making choices for tenure track positions in the hopes of ultimately doing better in the future. However, teaching needs must still be satisfied; hence temporary hiring abounds. Anything which requires departments to be more realistic about such matters should make the market less chaotic and improve the situation. Leonard Evens len@math.nwu.edu 708-491-5537 Dept. of Mathematics, Northwestern Univ., Evanston, IL 60208 ______________________________________________________________ Item #7 CLOSING CREDITS The Young Mathematicians' Network is administered by: Charles Yeomans cyeomans@s.ms.uky.edu Mark Winstead mwwinst@gcr.com Frank Sottile sottile@math.toronto.edu Vic Perera vperera@silver.ucs.indiana.edu Franklin Mendivil mendivil@math.gatech.edu Kevin Madigan madigan@math.nwu.edu Steve Kennedy skennedy@mathcs.carleton.edu Matt Hudelson hudelson@math.washington.edu Robert Dobrow dobrow@cam.nist.gov Lyle Cochran 74443.3055@compuserve.com Neil Calkin calkin@math.gatech.edu Wendy Brunzie brunzie@turing.ucdavis.edu Curtis Bennett cbennet@andy.bgsu.edu Frank Arlinghaus frank@math.ysu.edu Jeff Adams adams@bright.uoregon.edu Edward Aboufadel aboufade@scus1.ctstateu.edu _______________________________________________________________ End of Journal -- Next week: The Discussion Continues